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#1 16.03.2020 15:38:42

lupodimare89
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Border incident on 28 May 1939

Greetings and sorry for english ^^

I wanted to find more data and information about a border-conflict riverine incident occurred on 28 May 1939.
Here what i gathered so far:

Еще один катер этого типа"Jimin" был захвачен советскими пограничниками в бою 28.05.1939 г. на р. Уссури и либо не восстанавливался, либо остался в распоряжении Погранохраны. Однотипный "Enmin", тяжело поврежденный или погибший тогда же при взрыве, прибило течением к маньчжурскому берегу.

Both boat also with a different translated name:
http://www.navypedia.org/ships/manchuku … on_min.htm
http://sovnavyww2.aiq.ru/small/mchg.htm#mchg4
Yi Min (28/5/1939), En Min (28/5/1939)

Data including numbers of Soviet forces, how the actual fight occurred, the casualties and aftermath are all welcome.

 

#2 25.04.2020 18:55:25

lupodimare89
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Re: Border incident on 28 May 1939

Of the +200 views of this article, and none has ever see even a hint of these incidents/episodes in Soviet or Russian literature? : (

 

#3 26.04.2020 22:24:17

Skagerrak
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Re: Border incident on 28 May 1939

Hi,

This is a bit obscure incident, not so much info available, at least in the published sources.

You can find the description of this episode here - https://sakhalin.info/files/72375/page3 (scroll down to "28 мая 1939 года", the text is from the book "Граница накануне войны" (Border on the eve of war),
published in 1985, author is A.I. Chugunov (А.И. Чугунов)).

In short, it says that in the early morning of 28th May 3 enemy boats came to island No. 124 (another name is Barkasnyj island) on the Ussuri river
and machine-gunned the island. Then about 80 men landed from two of the boats. Soviet border guards fought back. Enemy boats caught fire and
one of the boats was towed to the Soviet territory by a KM type boat of the Soviet border guards. 2 Soviet armoured boats from Amur flotilla covered
the KM boat with their fire. Soviet losses were 1 KIA and 3 WIA. Enemy lost 2 patrol boats and 1 police boat.

By the way, the fight in this area started on 27th May (you can find the description in the same link in entry for 27th May ("27 мая 1939 года").

 

#4 29.04.2020 00:39:48

lupodimare89
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Re: Border incident on 28 May 1939

Big thanks for this help!! It was exactly what was needed to at least start to make a match and have some basic info!
There are still some missing elements or details, but now it's all far more clear: it is interesting that in a way was a little revenge for the more famous 1937 clash when a BKA was lost.

The text quite clearly merge Japanese with the Manchu. but i guess only Chinese (or Japanese?) data could indicate which troops and soldiers actually involved and their confirmed human losses. Could still be interesting to know in some other sources the identity of the BKA involved and the fate of the boat (if she was took over by the Border Guards or the Amur Flotilla: considering both took part at the clash).
Also from the text in the earlier day it is mentioned the loss of an own small Soviet boat (possibly used by the Guards stationed on the island at first?): maybe she is the same "police boat" mentioned at the end, and was simply re-captured on the island?

Anyway, big thanks. The other pages are also interesting, i read of an earlier incident on 16 May1939 where 5 men on a boat were captured: but maybe she was simply a rowboat rather than a motorboat, because she was lowered by a larger riverine craft.

 

#5 29.04.2020 22:09:41

Skagerrak
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Re: Border incident on 28 May 1939

You are welcome)

Found another Russian language source - an article, published in 2014 by D.V. Liventsev - "History Of Manchukuo Navy Formation And Activity", you can find it here - https://www.9111.ru/questions/777777777763506/

In short, it says that patrol boats "En Min", "Ji Min" and police boat landed 155 soldiers on islands No. 121, 124. During the fight all 3 boats were hit by rifle and
machine gun fire of the Soviet border guards. "En Min" blowed up and sank, "Ji Min" was taken to the Soviet shore by the current and police boat was beached on the
Manchukuo shore. 10 officers and 111 soldiers of Japanese-Manchukuo force were killed.

As you can see, there are differences with 1985 book by A.I. Chugunov.

"Ji Min" might be "Yi Min", actually - at least in your link - http://www.navypedia.org/ships/manchuku … on_min.htm
there is a "Yi Min" lost on 28 th May, but no "Ji Min".

As for Japanese/Manchukuo - Japanese operated alongside Manhukuo forces, so were called like Japanese-Manchukuo soldiers and alike in Soviet/Russian literature. However judging from the Japanese link
below, seems they might actually be Manchu cavalrymen from 10th Cavalry Corps under command of Japanese officers.

Unfortunately I don't have information on BKA identities and fate of the captured boat in Soviet/Russian sources.

I also found an article in Japanese, describing this incident (called "Dongan Town Incident" - "東安鎮事件") - https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%9D%B1 … B%E4%BB%B6

According to Japanese article (refering to Chikamitsu Ozawa "Historical Manchurian Army-The Role of Japanese Military Officers" Kashiwa Shobo, 1976 as a source), landing force included 80 men plus there were 28 crewmen on 2 patrol boats. It confirms the loss of both boats and of more than 80 men (seems almost whole landing force was wiped out, since it was 80 men), including force commander Captain Horie (? Not sure is it correct transliteration, since I used Google Translate).

Interesing that Japanese claim that captured "En Min" was sent to Europe (European Russia?) and that there were 1000 men from Soviet side (seems to be a wild overclaim judging by the description in Chugunov).

>it is interesting that in a way was a little revenge for the more famous 1937 clash when a BKA was lost.

Seems Japanese also though so - "The Soviet Union referred to the Dong'an Township incident as a retaliation for the Qingdao Island Incident and sent the captured gunboat " Emin" to Europe via Vidonaya as a loot".

Отредактированно Skagerrak (29.04.2020 22:32:35)

 

#6 29.04.2020 22:10:46

Skagerrak
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Re: Border incident on 28 May 1939

1

http://blog-imgs-10.fc2.com/i/s/o/isokaze/20070820211009.jpg

Postcard with Manchukuo partol boats, found here - http://isokaze.blog75.fc2.com/blog-entry-389.html

Looks like the one captured by Soviets:

http://sovnavyww2.aiq.ru/small/pic/mchg.jpg

Отредактированно Skagerrak (29.04.2020 22:42:27)

 

#7 30.04.2020 16:59:39

lupodimare89
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Re: Border incident on 28 May 1939

"Ji Min" might be "Yi Min", actually - at least in your link - http://www.navypedia.org/ships/manchuku … on_min.htm
there is a "Yi Min" lost on 28 th May, but no "Ji Min".

checked "Horie" (堀江) while sounds unusual it's a proper Japanese surname ((example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takafumi_Horie))


The postcards are also very interesting: Navypedia's photo has some similarities but seems smaller than seized craft in photo.
If we compare the picture of "On Min" class on navypedia with the seized boat we can see a larger cabin and the 11 portholes on each side that seems missing her: http://www.navypedia.org/uploads/images … a_cf_2.jpg

Ann interesting element from text however it seems the two ships were different to each other:
江防艦隊の砲艇「恩民」(排水量15t、村井佐之助上尉以下乗員13人)・「済民」(排水量25t、乗員15人)及び舟艇若干を率いて出動した[1]。

恩民 (EnMin) fitting with Navypedia description, 済民 (Jinmin) being larger: it could means then that "Jimin" was a different enlarged type.
The source used by navypedia possibly mixing up the 25-ton "Jimin" with the 15-ton "Yimin"


PS: the Postcard also mention other names of boats not indicated on Navypedia: similarities of names of these two different types could have lead to confusion

Отредактированно lupodimare89 (30.04.2020 17:21:36)

 

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