"I think this is somewhat mistake. I don't know what is "Neumann command" and what it was doing off Noworossijsk. I found nothing similar this in KTB ASM."

Found further data, i don't know how i could miss it, but it seems that the option of mistake of the engagement during 20 / 21 November has to be denied, yet that night there is a report that gives further confirmation of the existance of such group. It said that during the 20/21 November the SKA/TKA landing attempt had as result:  "attack was repulsed by 2 vessels of Neumann group. Causalities were light"
http://archive.org/stream/wardiarygerma … 4/mode/2up
Igor wrote me about 3 wia during an engagement but that was on 19/20, not the following night.

Still this is a clue about the existance of such cutter's group.

Sadly i could not find it now, but i'm pretty much sure that in the previous page at some point it was announced (in few words) the formation of such group: basically an harbor/coastal defensive cutter groups under command of this Neumann.

" Probably you are right. In KTB of Seekom. Kaukasus I found short record about engagement between kutter "Seidan" with a sinle MG and some soviet cutters off Schirokaja Balka about 01.00 September 20th (not November as you wrote above). The very engagement was described in KTB ASM like "See-Fahrzeuge des Einzatzkdos. Neumann".
BTW, "Seidan" sunk September 22nd in Schirokaja Balka as the result of close explosion of a small bomb. Later "Seidan" probably was raised (the works began on September 27th) "

Oh sorry! I'm terrible when i write about days & months <.< basically because i can work on this little hobby when i've finished study and i got a bit tired v.v
It's interesting about this "Seidan" ! But there is something that could be related to the second event ? (26 / 27 September).
Or maybe the report of cutter lost was about the loss of Seidan? Yet it seems from the KTB that the event occurred the same 27 Sept. (or maybe a delayed report of the previous day) and not a week before.

Thank you much!
About the previous engagement there was no detail about causalities? (as reported on the main KTB, that apart having some mistakes, could also imply causalities by the coastal forces, sadly it's poor of details).

BTW it's interesting the work i'm doing with igor on axisforum, for now apart that smal fishing cutter that i've wrote above didn't appeared other significant "never seen before" soviet successes with enemy losses. Even if a number of details of damages (light to medium) and few causalities are given for a number of engagements. We're in the middle of 1943 checking, and i think that a number of interesting events could still surface here and there.

I will write here if there is something of relevant or mysterious.

Thanks again for your time ^^

lupodimare89 написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #755923
About the previous engagement there was no detail about causalities? (as reported on the main KTB, that apart having some mistakes, could also imply causalities by the coastal forces, sadly it's poor of details).

There were no records about losses in KTB.

lupodimare89 написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #755923
I will write here if there is something of relevant or mysterious.

OK

maslopoop написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #756359
А куда на этот период перешли базировавшиеся на неё "щуки"?

На нее же и базировались. "Нева" чинилась без отрыва от производства.

Точно не скажу - подрывные патроны различной мощности. По материалам катастрофы на Щ-139 известно, что в 7-м отсеке над ТА хранились 23 подрывных патрона №3, но мощность их мне не известна.

vas63 написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #757130
Около 3 кг тротила

Это точные данные или предположение?
Дело в том, что подрывной патрон №2 был мощнее патрона №3. Это из тех же материалов расследования.

Приводя вес по памяти ошибся немного: ПП-3 - 2,5 кг, ПП-2 - 400 г.
http://116brigada.ru/content/zapiski-minera
http://u-96.livejournal.com/1570839.htm … d=28466967

Hello!
Working on the main english KTB and the Black Sea ones, i've found another pair of interesting events that with igor has  not managed to find a soviet side of the events.

First event:

Night of 25 / 26 September 1943
A clash between the MFP F-302 against what are reported to be "5 small gunboats" on the South Taman Coast from the h.02.22 of the day 26 September cause no damages to the Germans, but one man is killed in action.
The event is described with some details int the Black Sea KTB and seems pretty much confirmed yet it has proved unable to find who caused such causality.


Second (more interesting event):
Night of 6 / 7 October 1943
The German eboats S-42, S-48 and S-52 and a fourth one are on sea to try to attempt intercepting the group of Soviet main warships (Kharkov and 2 DDs) that were attacked the previous day and were then sunk by German aircrafts.
Both the Black Sea KTB and the main KTB say they clashed after h 19. 45 (of day 6)  with a group of Soviet gunboats "including the ones with 75mm" (these ones should have been 1125 class: previously the Germans often described them as the "gunboats with 75mm" even if the main gun was of 76mm).
During the engagement German suffered damages:
S-42 had a 40mm gun put out of action.
S-48 had a 45mm hit in her collision compartment.
S-52 had slight fragment damages
Also Germans claimed that 2 enemy vessels got 20mm and 40mm hits.
Text of KTB:  https://archive.org/stream/wardiaryofad … 5/mode/2up

Sadly it not surfaced who could have ben involved: igor found that  "  t's just mentioned that 7.10.43 early 5 TKA and 6 SKA returned from search. "
Could they have been involved?

Thank you very much! These are very interesting confirmation!
Sorry for that mistake (i try my best but can work on this only after university/study, when i'm a bit tired, apart rare holidays).

Thank you for kind words, I'll consider about your info of PQ-13 battle.

Думаю, да, хотя у меня по походам ПЛ СФ проходит 15 упоминаний. Далеко не всегда факт присутствия обеспечивающего попадал в боевое донесение, особенно если в походе ничего не происходило.

Поднят 3 сентября 1944 г. А у Вас есть фото этого события?