Hello again, i replied to CAM on that site (found on an italian article at least the name of the MAS commander).


I've another interesting clash in Black Sea that i lacked to find some detail.

It's about the night between 31 July and 1 August 1943.

It appears that lots of units were involved in some clashes, only among Germans there were s-boats, r-boats, MFP and MAL.

Going in order we have:
from 01.50 to 02.10,  F-418 vs "soviet gunboats" (no hits appears on both sides).
another clash at 05.40.  German aircrafts claim to have seen a boat on fire.
At 06.10 r-boats vs "soviet gunboats".
Another big clash with R-60 and MAL-8,9,10 and 11  vs "6 soviet units". (this was 15 miles west of Primorsko Akhtari).
Fight should have occurred between 03.02 and 03.20. Later involving also S-boats

In the whole night, i've found on one of the KTBs that 1 S-boat got minor hits.

Igor provided data about involvment of SKA-0112 and BKA-111 and 121 (shelling on coast).
Later involvment of 2 other BKA and SKA-0712.
And finally the first group clashed again with enemies during return.
Also there was involvment of Il-2 aircrafts


About this engagement, the focus could be of course on the S-boats actions: if it's confirmed one suffered light damages? (and who?)  and who they engaged?
There were other damaging on both sides during the night?

Отредактированно lupodimare89 (25.05.2014 12:08:26)

CAM написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #832508
Ответ коллеги я выложил на ветке "Вооружение торпедных катеров".

И правильно. Не хотелось бы, чтобы ветка вопросов ув. Андрею Ярославовичу превращалась в обсуждение далеких от его интересов театров.

Thanks! It's not known however the identity of S-boats and who was the one that got the hit?

Thank you very much !

Here another engagement that (if you have time) could deserve some interest.


On night between 22 and  23 August 1944, in Black Sea.

It should have been the LAST soviet surface engagement in Black Sea.
Also it's interesting because it (should) be the first and only engagement of lend-leased former Allied MTBs in Black Sea.

Finally it's interesting for being the (that i know) second engagement involving German UJ  vs soviets surface units.

Thanks Ivan, he provided the names of the Soviet attackers: TK 221, 223, 227 and 233.
TK-227 was badly damaged with 3 KIA and 5 WIA.

Sadly i've failed to know the identity of the German units.
The KTB i've read say they were 2 but provided no name.
They correctly identified the 4 attacking TK, and claimed one sunk, while evading 2 soviet torpedoes.

You've knowledge of the identity of the German UJ ?
And if they possibly got light damages or casualties?

Отредактированно lupodimare89 (09.06.2014 19:30:06)

Ответил в ветке

No problem, and sorry for the big delay reply (i've been busy with study v.v)

If you've time, here another interesting clash that i failed to find details.

Again in Black Sea, 18 April 1943.
Soviets lost in battle SKA-54, and i've also that SKA-58 was damaged alongside a third one (unknown to me).
Germans had S-28, S-47, S-72, S-102.
Damages reported on S-28, S-47 and S-102.

There are mistakes? You have confirmation for damages on Germans and some knowledge of casualties on both side?

Thanks, this is a bit surprising.

I remember that Morozov put the SKA054 among the victims of German MTBs in Black Sea.
But is list isn't recent and probably it was a revised case.

I don't remember where i found mentions of German damages, but i think it was some wrongly old page.
I will try to re-find the link.

lupodimare89 написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #852073
I remember that Morozov put the SKA054 among the victims of German MTBs in Black Sea.

Most probably SKA-054 has hit a mine from the barrage laid by S-Boote on 28.2.43. So she was a victim of German MTBs though not by torpedoes or guns.

Thank you both! Now it's clear to me ^^

Здравствуйте!

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #857619
по вопросу связанному c десантами на Тархан и в Керчь в январе 1944 г.

Посмотрите мою статью о бронекатерах в "Морской войне" (два номера в 2009). Там в основном о морской составляющей этих операций, но м.б. чем-то поможет. Пираты давно эти журналы выложили в сеть, так что проблем с поиском не должно быть.

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #857619
Какие части противника осуществляли оборону побережья в данных районах?

Усиленная 98 пд 5-го ак. Очень сильно усиленная.

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #857619
Береговые батареи (75-мм, 88-мм или 105-мм?) на Тархане входили в состав Вермахта или Кригсмарине?

От флота там был 613-й дивизион (MAA), по морским целям (в том числе) работала и ЗА люфтваффе (27-й полк 9-й зенад). Применялось ли в этот период по морю что-то армейское, я не помню.

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #857619
Потери Люфтваффе при противодействии высадке на Тархан.

Полная картина не ясна и вряд ли будет известна, т.к. донесения генерал-квартирмейстеру о потерях за 1944 год не сохранились (во всяком случае, пока не найдены), да и всё равно они полной картины не дают. А документы частей в подавляющем большинстве утрачены. Кое-что может быть в радиоперехватах ("Ультра"), но это в любом случае обрывки.

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #857619
При описании боёв на Тархане упоминается отражение десантниками танковой атаки противника. Были ли это танки из румынских батальонов?

Это были штуги 191-го дивизиона.

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #857619
Почему немецкие корабли не осуществили перехват десантных сил?

У Тархана они оказаться не могли, а у Керчи пытались вмешаться, но неудачно. Посмотрите в вышеупомянутой статье, там описано.

АСМ написал:

Оригинальное сообщение #858001
Участвовали ли "штуги" 191-го дивизиона или румынские танки в боях за порт Керчь в январе 1944 г.?

Штуги участвовали. Румынские танки, насколько помню - нет. Они в районе Ак-Монайских позиций оставались.

Уточнение по артиллерии БО, на всякий случай. 613-й дивизион в Керчи активно участвовал, а у Тархана - нет, ему там нечем было воевать.

Hello again!

This time i've made a little research about submarine U-344.
In an article of your, you've mentioned possibility that submarine was indeed sunk by Soviet DDs in 22-23 August 1944.

Igor (on axihistory) told me of some doubts and that U-344 should have evaded the British air attack on 22 August, to fall victim of the second destroyer attack you mentioned (Жгучий) on 23 August  (AC2741)


Checking a translated KTB, i've gathered the following data: https://archive.org/stream/wardiaryofca … 7/mode/2up

After the attack made by U-344 in AB-5450, submarine received order to keep on at 60° from that location (to east, i suppose)

At 08.00 of day 22 August, the German Command believed U-344 to be in AB-3950
Not far from the position of the British aerial attack (AB3852) that claimed the sinking, and the attack of destroyer Хеджехога  (AB3826)

The last radio message "0201/717" recored.
“Am in 6110. Maximum speed 14.5 knots because of blower fault.  Query: shall I continue to advance?”
The mentioned reply it's
“The boat was of course told in next order to continue”.

I may guess that it was AB 6110.

After that there is the order was to reach AC1525 at high speed.

There is a further message from command that say
"Group Trutz: occupy new patrol line  from AC2546 to 2785, former order "Piotsch" to "Sthamor", high speed."

(i've not fully understood this message, basically it's ordering to commander "Sthamer " (U-354)  to take place of U-344?
Final position believed of U-344 was AC2345 at 08.00 of 23 August.


You've already knowledge of all these data? You've revised-had other evaluation of the possible involvment of soviets in her sinking?
A detail i remember from igor it's that submarine should have sailed at high speed, and from orders it seems subs actually received such instructions (of high speed).